Steve Jobs - Thoughts On Adobe Flash

[smiley]

i found it interesting..and kind of true

Steve Jobs Answers Adobe Flash

[KRM]

lol @ Steve Jobs wanting open standards when he locks all his own shit down.

[dizmo]

not an apple boy but that was spot on.

[aicoBitchinCamaro]

Make sense to me.

[smiley]

of course Jobs will spin it somewhat....but much of what he says isnt that far off

[aicoBitchinCamaro]

I stopped using Flash when Adobe bought it from Macromedia. It was neat once, just kind of pointless now. I have FLV on my sites, maybe I should look into how to do HTML5 video

[Cleo]

I remember back in the nineties when Apple said the floppy was dead and released the iMac with no floppy drive.

Flash is dead or at least will be soon.

Facebook just this week announced they were switching to html5.

[MP]

What a fucking dick head.

[Alienq]

I couldnt have said it better.

I have long disliked flash, I have long disliked having to buy Flash Suit every 2 months, I hated how intensive flash is on a system. Infact there was never one thing I liked about flash. Ever.

His statements regarding .H264 are spot on.


Well said Steve Jobs!

[artwilliams]

Open standards when it serves Apple needs. LOL

[KRM]

HTML5 is nice but it's not ready for prime time yet. Adobe Flash 10.1 has greatly increased it's effectiveness. The GPU acceleration really does a great job of taking strain of the CPU. If you think that Steve Jobs is working for anything more than money and control you're a fool. He's a brilliant man that has put out some great stuff. But he's a self serving asshole all the same.

[Cleo]

Some interesting html5 demos on this page.

[aicoBitchinCamaro]

Why is Microsoft so far off the reservation? So basically for video you have to make two videos mp4 and ogv and it picks whichever one the browser supports?

[smiley]

HTML5 is nice but it's not ready for prime time yet. Adobe Flash 10.1 has greatly increased it's effectiveness. The GPU acceleration really does a great job of taking strain of the CPU. If you think that Steve Jobs is working for anything more than money and control you're a fool. He's a brilliant man that has put out some great stuff. But he's a self serving asshole all the same.

Aren't they all thou....Gates, Jobs.....basically any CEO of these type companies

[dgchi]

Flash is coming out for Android this month, it is going to be awesome

[aicoBitchinCamaro]

Flash is coming out for Android this month, it is going to be awesome

Ya good luck with that...
"Adobe publicly said that Flash would ship on a smartphone in early 2009, then the second half of 2009, then the first half of 2010, and now they say the second half of 2010. We think it will eventually ship, but we’re glad we didn’t hold our breath. Who knows how it will perform?"

[Mailman]

Ya good luck with that...
"Adobe publicly said that Flash would ship on a smartphone in early 2009, then the second half of 2009, then the first half of 2010, and now they say the second half of 2010. We think it will eventually ship, but we’re glad we didn’t hold our breath. Who knows how it will perform?"

when its obsolete it will ship!

[Cleo]

Adobe bought GoLive, ruined it and then killed it. Kind of looks like they are doing the same thing with Flash.

[Toby]

If iPhones were Flash capable dozens, if not hundreds, of Apps in Apple's App Store would no longer be needed since essentially the same thing could be accessed via web browser.

There's your motivation for not implementing Flash, it's all about money, just like it always is whether it's Apple or Microsoft or Adobe or whoever.

[dgchi]

Flash is part of the Android 2.2 update that is due in a couple of weeks, this time is for real

[Peedy]

I found his view pretty spon on. Standards are preferred. Flash was once needed because it was sort of a bridge because HTML couldn't do the things it could....however HTML5 solves much of that...so the need of the bridge is much less.

[Jim_Gunn]

I don't use Apple products. But I found Jobs' comments to be pretty pursuasive. I am probably getting an Android phone soon. Hopefully the Flash integration Andorid has or Windows mobile phones has will display Flash well. Then if HTML 5 takes over, the transition will be easy since HTML developers and Flash developers will work out the bugs in both for mobile devices.

[aicoBitchinCamaro]

Adobe bought GoLive, ruined it and then killed it. Kind of looks like they are doing the same thing with Flash.

They also bought Flash, and ruined it as well. Flash was originally the watered down version of Director. Director, before it died, did 100x's more than flash does now. It has it's own programming language called Lingo. Adobe bought Macromedia, killed Director, and is now fucking up Flash.

[Cleo]

Microsoft mostly sides with Apple in HTML5 fight

Microsoft late Thursday said it largely sided with Apple in the dispute over Flash. The Windows developer's General Manager for Internet Explorer, Dean Hachamovitch, argued that HTML5 was the future of the web and cited the same problems with Flash mentioned by Apple's Steve Jobs. "Reliability, security, and performance" are all issues with Adobe's plugin, Hachamovitch said.
He added that Internet Explorer 9 will support HTML5 from the outset and will only support H.264, the same video format Apple recognizes for its own implementation. Its role as a widespread standard is important as video recorded from a camcorder or another device can be put on the web and played without having to switch codecs, the Microsoft executive said. H.264 is also hardware-accelerated on both Apple and Microsoft devices.

Mozilla and many open-source advocates have been trying to promote Ogg Theora as the default HTML5 video standard, but it has relatively little support outside of Firefox.

Hachamovitch wasn't as hostile towards Flash as Jobs and said the plugin "remains an important part" of the web as it is today. However, he didn't expect Adobe's technology to remain in that position forever.

"The future of the web is HTML5," he said.

[smiley]

Microsoft mostly sides with Apple in HTML5 fight

Ouch...

[Peedy]

They also bought Flash, and ruined it as well. Flash was originally the watered down version of Director. Director, before it died, did 100x's more than flash does now. It has it's own programming language called Lingo. Adobe bought Macromedia, killed Director, and is now fucking up Flash.

Damn I remember learning Director in high school....loved that shit! Yeah seems like Adobe is a confused mess these days.

[Peedy]

Microsoft mostly sides with Apple in HTML5 fight

Unusual ally thats for sure...but its good to see Microsoft standing up for standards.

[artwilliams]

Microsoft mostly sides with Apple in HTML5 fight

As a 64 bit Linux user, I know what what a bitch Flash can be. Given that both Apple and MS are late converts to open standards (and only when it serves their needs) you have to wonder if their true motive is to screw Adobe. Do a Google search on "XML Microsoft Open Office" and you'll see that MS's only interest is itself.

[smiley]

As a 64 bit Linux user, I know what what a bitch Flash can be. Given that both Apple and MS are late converts to open standards (and only when it serves their needs) you have to wonder if their true motive is to screw Adobe. Do a Google search on "XML Microsoft Open Office" and you'll see that MS's only interest is itself.

yeah, i believe that both Apple & MS will always look out for their best interests...kind of surprised to see MS actually (sort of) support what Jobs was saying...should be interesting how this plays out

[Alienq]

Microsoft mostly sides with Apple in HTML5 fight

Thats the bombshell right there.

Big boom. FLash is done for.

[aicoBitchinCamaro]

Microsoft mostly sides with Apple in HTML5 fight

IE has never followed standards, should be interesting to see this play out. As it stands now HTML 5 doesn't really work on any version of IE (maybe 1 or 2 things), and everyday people don't always upgrade, mostly they don't.

[SCORE-Ralph]

A web well-spun, is a well-spun web.

[DamianJ]

HTML5 is nice but it's not ready for prime time yet.

Because?

Adobe Flash 10.1 has greatly increased it's effectiveness. The GPU acceleration really does a great job of taking strain of the CPU.

Where is the GPU in the iPhone? Which is what he is talking about.

[Cleo]

Where is the GPU in the iPhone? Which is what he is talking about.

Where is the GPU in just about anything except some versions of Windows?

[KRM]

Because?

Well for one it's not even a finished standard yet. Sure it's functional right now. But the final standard isn't projected to get ratified by the WC3 til 2012. Plus on the developers end the tools for HTML5 just aren't nearly as effective as flash development tools. I'm sure they will eventually get there but they are not there right now.

Where is the GPU in the iPhone? Which is what he is talking about.

THe iphone 3gs uses a PowerVR SGX gpu which for a phone is freaking awesome. It could handle flash without any problems. I know flash has been quite a resource whore in the past but adobe has done some great stuff. Not enough yet. But they are getting there.

Fact of the matter is Steve Jobs is an egomaniac that thinks everybody else is stupid. Who cares if you've paid a premium for your ipad/iphone/mac you're to use it the way he intended so shut up about it. Guess i'm just the kind of guy that thinks if you've bought hardware you should be able to use it how you want. Sure flash might not run optimally on the iphone/ipad but people should be given the option. h.264 built into the iphone/ipad so it's always going to be the optimal choice to go with html5. But that doesn't mean that it's right for everything. Steve Jobs would never give up control though as it would cut hugely into his profits. Sorry just not a fan of closed standards.

Damn i've written way to much and feel like a nerd now. Time to go pick out what i'm going to have for dinner. I hope they have a nice meat selection since i'm going a little late.

[aicoBitchinCamaro]

blah blah blah I'm a big nerd.

[Cleo]

Guess i'm just the kind of guy that thinks if you've bought hardware you should be able to use it how you want. Sure flash might not run optimally on the iphone/ipad but people should be given the option. h.264 built into the iphone/ipad so it's always going to be the optimal choice to go with html5. But that doesn't mean that it's right for everything. Steve Jobs would never give up control though as it would cut hugely into his profits. Sorry just not a fan of closed standards.

Buy an iPhone, jailbreak it, install Flash and enjoy your 20 minutes of battery power.

[KRM]

Buy an iPhone, jailbreak it, install Flash and enjoy your 20 minutes of battery power.

I'd jailbreak but I don't want apple labeling me a terrorist. As far as battery power goes 20 minutes isn't much more than an apple in the first place. Battery is actually what has me most excited about iphone 4. Sure they can't put a big battery like the ipad but the battery technology they have used for that thing is light years ahead of the old iphone batteries. I hope they can make the next iphone go a full day without having to be recharged. I don't mind having to plug my phone in every night but to have to during the day just sucks. Oh and Steve for the love of god please get off the ATT network it's been the bain of my existence for the last 10 years.

[ShiftyEyedBstrd]

lol, that's funny considering even the fucking power plugs to most of apples shit is proprietary. It's funny that Apple the "rebels" are worse than MS these days.

[aicoBitchinCamaro]

Oh and Steve for the love of god please get off the ATT network it's been the bain of my existence for the last 10 years.

AMEN! Still hoping for the Verizon announcement this year sometime.

[dgchi]

the battery life on the Droid is excellent, I watch youtube, stream audio, surf etc etc etc all day and the battery lasts me all day

[artwilliams]

There is much more to this story than I thought:

http://www.osnews.com/story/23233/Jo...o_After_Theora

The "open standard" that Apple and Microsoft want is in fact based on patented technology. Open source Theora which Google wants to use will soon be squashed by Jobs and his patent holding buddies.

[dgchi]

There is much more to this story than I thought:

http://www.osnews.com/story/23233/Jo...o_After_Theora

The "open standard" that Apple and Microsoft want is in fact based on patented technology. Open source Theora which Google wants to use will soon be squashed by Jobs and his patent holding buddies.

...good reason enough to not buy iphones

[smiley]

AMEN! Still hoping for the Verizon announcement this year sometime.

i talked with verizon last week..my BBTour trackball took a shit on me and i was complaining about the phone suckins and that if they dont do something ill leave Verizon and go to ATT...the girl told me that the plan is by the end of the year Verizon will have the iPhone

[Cleo]

...good reason enough to not buy iphones

Good enough reason not to buy an Android phone

Unlike the rapidly deployed updates Apple posts for the iPhone OS through iTunes, Android users are unlikely (and often unable) to apply the latest updates to their phones, according to new information published by Google and its AdMob subsidiary.

As is the case with most other alternative smartphone platforms, Android users appear to often remain stuck with the firmware version their phone shipped with originally. This is primarily due to fragmentation problems that require the hardware maker, software platform vendor, and the mobile provider to work together to create and deliver custom updates for each model.

According to Android OS ad traffic figures published by AdMob, there was an initial migration from Android 1.5 "Cupcake" to 1.6 "Donut" last fall, followed by another shift to Android 2.x "Eclair" during the holiday season. But rather than being the result of user's software upgrade cycles, it appears that the shifts were largely the result of new hardware being sold with the new version already installed on it.

"In November 2009, Android 2.0 (Eclair) gained momentum with the launch of the Motorola Droid," AdMob reports, adding that "The Motorola Droid continues to generate the vast majority of requests of Android 2.0/2.1."

In March, AdMob pointed out that the ad traffic it was monitoring remained "divided relatively evenly between the three primary versions of the OS: Android 1.5 (38%), Android 2.0 / 2.1 (35%) and Android 1.6 (26%)."

The reason for that is that users of earlier models in many cases simply can't upgrade because there's no easy to install update for their phone. Many Android phone models do not get the latest operating system updates for months after the official update is completed, due to delays by the provider or hardware maker, either of which may want or need to address layers of customization they've made to the generic Android distribution.

[dgchi]

that is just negative irrelevance, I installed 2.1 on my phone very easily the day it was released, and I expect to do the same with 2.1 and Flash very soon too


just because there are people still using version 2.0 of wordpress doesn't say anything about whether you should go out and install version 2.9 because it requires clicking a few links

[aicoBitchinCamaro]

iPhone FTW!

[Cleo]

that is just negative irrelevance, I installed 2.1 on my phone very easily the day it was released, and I expect to do the same with 2.1 and Flash very soon too


just because there are people still using version 2.0 of wordpress doesn't say anything about whether you should go out and install version 2.9 because it requires clicking a few links

Yeah but you are a geek and enjoy messing with software and hardware. On the other hand I just want to use my devices without having to mess with shit or read the manual.

Buy iPhone, plug into iTunes, and you are ready to go with all your email accounts, SMTP settings, contacts, appointments, photo albums, music with playlists, movies, applications, and everything else without having to mess with any settings on the phone or computer. Plus everything is automatically updated whenever the iPhone is plugged back into the USB port to charge.

My iPhone just works. When I get the new model that is coming out in a few months all I have to do is plug it into iTunes and everything will be automatically transferred to my new iPhone without me having to do anything.

To be honest I don't really care about Flash and actually have it blocked by default on my laptop using ClickToFlash.

But if I really need to view something that is in Flash from my iPhone I can by using VNC on my iPhone and logging into one of my home computers although I've yet to have ever actually needed to access something in Flash by doing this.

Plus my iPhone is so kewl that I can even pickup straight chicks with it.

[Peedy]

Yeah but you are a geek and enjoy messing with software and hardware. On the other hand I just want to use my devices without having to mess with shit or read the manual.

Buy iPhone, plug into iTunes, and you are ready to go with all your email accounts, SMTP settings, contacts, appointments, photo albums, music with playlists, movies, applications, and everything else without having to mess with any settings on the phone or computer. Plus everything is automatically updated whenever the iPhone is plugged back into the USB port to charge.

My iPhone just works. When I get the new model that is coming out in a few months all I have to do is plug it into iTunes and everything will be automatically transferred to my new iPhone without me having to do anything.

This is exactly what people lose sight of. We are not the majority. My Mom could care less about the tech stuff, she just wants and easy to use phone that works, doesn't crash, etc. Just as in another recent thread about Linux....yeah tell my mom, oh you need to run a windows vm to use quicken. That is why Linux doesn't make it on the desktop and why Apple devices do so well. Their end to end ecosystem whether you like it or not the majority does because its the best experience out there.

[ShiftyEyedBstrd]

nah, your mom would just use gnucash and get it over with, lol.

I also seriously doubt she is installing her own operating system regardless of what it is, and if she has the ability to do that, she would have the ability to install a VM.

Not everything has to cater to the lowest common denominator.

Also itunes is the biggest piece of shit I have ever had the displeasure of working with. Make a playlist of everyfucking thing, which creates a duplicate copy on your HD? No thanks. Just give me a mp3 player that works as a hard drive, and I'll copy paste it over.